| বিষয়ের পেজ: < [1 2 3 4 5] > | Off topic: Clichés, anyone? (1) "I shall not rest" (2) "tireless/tirelessly" থ্রেড পোস্টার: Mervyn Henderson (X)
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gianfranco 
ব্রাজিল
Local time: 15:16
2001 থেকে সদস্য
ইংরেজি থেকে ইটালিয়ান
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Oliver Walter wrote:
fast-food premises and cafés in England offer "paninis" (filled, Italian-style bread rolls), in ignorance of the fact that a bread roll is a "panino" and "panini" is already plural.
OMG. It could be because they... like... fill them with ("in the air") salamis.
But this is, you know, like... a diversion, I mean... from the core issue: clichés.
| | | | Jack Doughty
যুক্তরাজ্য
Local time: 19:16
রাশিয়ান থেকে ইংরেজি
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স্মরণে | @ Mervyn & Trudy | May 7, 2014 |
@ Mervyn
"I shall not rest..."
Can sound good in a poem though
"I shall not cease from mental strife,
Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand,
Till we have built Jerusalem
In England's green and pleasant land."
(Jerusalem, by William Blake.)
@ Trudy
Surely...
This reminds me of the gag in the film "Airplane", in which the second pilot keeps saying to the captain "But surely...?"
and the captain alwa... See more @ Mervyn
"I shall not rest..."
Can sound good in a poem though
"I shall not cease from mental strife,
Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand,
Till we have built Jerusalem
In England's green and pleasant land."
(Jerusalem, by William Blake.)
@ Trudy
Surely...
This reminds me of the gag in the film "Airplane", in which the second pilot keeps saying to the captain "But surely...?"
and the captain always snaps back "Don't call me Shirley!"
[Edited at 2014-05-07 07:00 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Danish clichés are no better | May 7, 2014 |
With suitable trumpet accompaniment, as at Last Night of the Proms, or just a creditable choir, William Blake's Jerusalem IS great.
Trouble with many clichés is that they were originally great - until they caught on.
Or are used, according to a Danish cliché, at all times, early or late. (I tide og utide)
One of our dearest (Danish) family friends is getting old, and starts almost every sentence with: 'Then I would turn round and say ...'
It makes me quit... See more With suitable trumpet accompaniment, as at Last Night of the Proms, or just a creditable choir, William Blake's Jerusalem IS great.
Trouble with many clichés is that they were originally great - until they caught on.
Or are used, according to a Danish cliché, at all times, early or late. (I tide og utide)
One of our dearest (Danish) family friends is getting old, and starts almost every sentence with: 'Then I would turn round and say ...'
It makes me quite dizzy!
While our not-so-respected politicians start every comment with 'Yes, but of course ... '
They carry on with but... but... but... before each clause, until anyone trying to follow their logic is 'completely round on the floor'
(Dizzy again, I suppose!)
Or else the politicians' ideas are 'right up in the air'
(becase they have 'lost all connection with the earth' or are out of touch with reality).
Well, as our friend would turn round and say, we have the politicians we voted for!
For better or worse, they don't translate well.
(PS I've never managed to read more than three pages at a time of Chomsky. Am I missing anything?) ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kay Denney
ফ্রান্স
Local time: 20:16
ফেঞ্চ/ফরাসি থেকে ইংরেজি
hear of the little old lady who went to the theatre for the first time in her life?
She didn't like it though, she felt that Hamlet didn't live up to its reputation, the script was ridden with cliché.
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neilmac
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
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No, seriously, I get the drift of the post, but I do feel that there is a still place for cliché, especially if used judiciously. I think that as translators we are perhaps overexposed to this kind of thing, especially in business texts, which are often riddled with management speak (or as I like to call it, meaningless twaddle), whereas the people who use these expressions may be unaware that we have already seen half a dozen “synergies” that day... and by now are ready to strangle the nex... See more No, seriously, I get the drift of the post, but I do feel that there is a still place for cliché, especially if used judiciously. I think that as translators we are perhaps overexposed to this kind of thing, especially in business texts, which are often riddled with management speak (or as I like to call it, meaningless twaddle), whereas the people who use these expressions may be unaware that we have already seen half a dozen “synergies” that day... and by now are ready to strangle the next one that raises its ugly head on the page.
Some of the most irritating examples nowadays for me pay lip-service to environmental concerns (“sustainability” is one currently eliciting rueful inner groans). The BBC has a couple of reasonably funny comedy series where a large part of the humour consists of knowingly laughing about the excessive use of this type of language – one of them, Twenty Twelve, is about the London Olympics:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00yw1t9
Perhaps my opinion is slanted though, as a translator colleague once called me “Mr Cliché” because I tend to pepper my conversation with things like “if you can't be good, be careful” or “don't do anything I would”... “baby and bathwater”, etc. Or maybe I’m just lazy. In fact, to prove that I am (though I didn't even read it all), here’s a link to a blog that I think sort of sums up my ambivalence:
http://blog.technoledge.com.au/2013/09/26/copywriting-in-defence-of-cliches/ ▲ Collapse
| | | | Tom in London
যুক্তরাজ্য
Local time: 19:16
2008 থেকে সদস্য
ইটালিয়ান থেকে ইংরেজি
OK Neil, you've hoisted that one up the flagpole. Now let's see if anyone salutes it.
| | | | nordiste
ফ্রান্স
Local time: 20:16
ইংরেজি থেকে ফেঞ্চ/ফরাসি
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| neilmac
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
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| Advocate of the Devil | May 7, 2014 |
Suzan Hamer wrote:
And even worse, "from the git-go."
AND "on a daily basis." What is wrong with just plain old "daily"?
[Edited at 2014-05-06 14:18 GMT]
I feel I must take up the gauntlet on behalf of "on a daily/monthly/yearly/quarterly basis". I occasionally use forms like this when I feel the sentence calls for a bit of rhythm, especially if the shorter versions have already been used in the same sentence or paragraph. What I am trying to say - without resorting to my baby and bathwater cliché yet again - is that brevity may not always be the best policy.
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neilmac
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
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| Anyone for pizze? | May 7, 2014 |
Oliver Walter wrote:
fast-food premises and cafés in England offer "paninis" (filled, Italian-style bread rolls), in ignorance of the fact that a bread roll is a "panino" and "panini" is already plural.
So how do you feel about "pizzas"?
Phttp://english.stackexchange.com/questions/60905/how-do-i-pluralize-italian-foods-like-pasta-noodles-spaghetti-macaroni
"It's done very much on a case-by-case basis: some words follow the Italian singular/plural, but many don't. Generally pasta things like spaghetti, macaroni, linguini are used for the uncountable (although it's linguine in italian.) For a single piece, you say "a piece of ...". However, we say one pizza and two pizzas (not two pizze). And we say one panini and two paninis, even though in Italian panini is already plural and a single is panino"
| | | | neilmac
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
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Noni Gilbert wrote:
I've just finished a round of interviewing for teachers for my language school. Rare was the candidate who didn't use the expression. What DO they mean? That they have been lying up until that moment?
We all do it. In an interview situation, I don't think 100% honesty is always the best policy.
| | | | neilmac
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
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Tom in London wrote:
OK Neil, you've hoisted that one up the flagpole. Now let's see if anyone salutes it.
Just flying a kite there
| | | | Tom in London
যুক্তরাজ্য
Local time: 19:16
2008 থেকে সদস্য
ইটালিয়ান থেকে ইংরেজি
So I've had enough of people who begin every statement with "so".
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Mervyn Henderson (X)
স্পেন
Local time: 20:16
স্প্যানিশ থেকে ইংরেজি
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | "At this point in time" | May 7, 2014 |
My dad, an affable and kindly man I have spent the greater part of my life not imitating, unfortunately, used to fly into an uncharacteristic rage whenever he heard this one, constantly used by reporters and politicians on BBC Northern Ireland. It does conjure up an image of a line representing time, with a little dot on it to show the point we've reached so far.
| | | | Kay Denney
ফ্রান্স
Local time: 20:16
ফেঞ্চ/ফরাসি থেকে ইংরেজি
| another joke springs to mind | May 7, 2014 |
neilmac wrote:
Noni Gilbert wrote:
I've just finished a round of interviewing for teachers for my language school. Rare was the candidate who didn't use the expression. What DO they mean? That they have been lying up until that moment?
We all do it. In an interview situation, I don't think 100% honesty is always the best policy.
"What's your worst fault?"
"Total honesty"
"I wouldn't call that a fault"
"I don't give a damn what you think"
| | | | Giles Watson
ইটালি
Local time: 20:16
ইটালিয়ান থেকে ইংরেজি
স্মরণে | Collecting clichés | May 7, 2014 |
Does anyone else collect clichés?
I do a lot of journalistic translations and the odd judiciously selected cliché can perk up a piece remarkably.
The problem is that the right cliché can be very hard to remember, particularly if you're under pressure from a deadline measurable in hours rather than days. Needless to say, the expression you were looking for often pops into your head as soon as you've hit "send".
... See more Does anyone else collect clichés?
I do a lot of journalistic translations and the odd judiciously selected cliché can perk up a piece remarkably.
The problem is that the right cliché can be very hard to remember, particularly if you're under pressure from a deadline measurable in hours rather than days. Needless to say, the expression you were looking for often pops into your head as soon as you've hit "send".
Some time ago, I started feeding these idioms, their Italian equivalents and the contexts they seemed to work in into a MultiTerm termbase (other terminology management tools are available). It's come in useful on quite a number of occasions. Does anyone else do this sort of thing? ▲ Collapse
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