Struggling after my B. A. - choosing a Master’s degree and a specialization
Thread poster: Dennis Zybin
Dennis Zybin
Dennis Zybin
Germany
Local time: 18:14
Chinese to German
+ ...
Mar 28, 2021

I have graduated last year with a B. A. in East Asian Studies and I thought that because I know Chinese, Russian, English and German, it should not be too hard for me to find work as a freelance translator. I was wrong.

My first native language is German, and most German agencies follow ISO 17100, which disqualifies me. I don’t have 2 years of experience, and my degree is formally not a translation degree, even though it was very language-centered and I have taken three translati
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I have graduated last year with a B. A. in East Asian Studies and I thought that because I know Chinese, Russian, English and German, it should not be too hard for me to find work as a freelance translator. I was wrong.

My first native language is German, and most German agencies follow ISO 17100, which disqualifies me. I don’t have 2 years of experience, and my degree is formally not a translation degree, even though it was very language-centered and I have taken three translation courses.

I have applied to more than 80 agencies without any success. To get work, I need experience, and to get experience, I need work. Maybe Covid also plays a role, I suppose companies are cutting down on translation costs…

So now, I am thinking about getting a Master’s degree in translation, and I have a few questions:

1. Will a Master’s degree in translation make it possible for me to become a freelance translator, or will it be just as difficult afterwards?

On the internet, some people write that translators are underpaid and that any other career is better, others seem to be making a good salary end enjoying it. I am insecure about whether a degree will really improve my career prospects.

2. Does it make sense for me to enroll in a Chinese-English program if English is not my native language and I am more likely to get projects to translate into German than into English?

I would much prefer getting a Master’s degree in China or Singapore rather than in Germany or Austria. However, those countries do not offer translation degrees with German as a target language, but only Chinese-English.

3. Is it true that if I specialize in financial translation, I can make a good hourly salary? And is Chinese-German a language pair that is in high demand and well paid?

I thought that Chinese-German should be profitable, because these countries have strong economic ties and few Germans know Chinese and there are not as many Chinese in Germany as in English-speaking countries.
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Dan Lucas
Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:14
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
The power of focus Mar 28, 2021

Dennis Zybin wrote:
2. Does it make sense for me to enroll in a Chinese-English program if English is not my native language and I am more likely to get projects to translate into German than into English?

I suspect that the best clients generally adhere to the "use a native speaker" rule of thumb when looking for high-quality translations into English. Think about it. Can you write English with the subtlety and range of an excellent (not just an average) native speaker of English?

I'm willing to believe that such people exist, but I also have to think they are vanishingly rare, and if the client is using "native speaker" as a heuristic when looking for translations into English then native speakers of German will get filtered out early on, however good they are. If I were you I'd focus on German.

Dennis Zybin wrote:
I thought that because I know Chinese, Russian, English and German, it should not be too hard for me to find work as a freelance translator.

There's plenty of work, but you may find it difficult to get paid at a reasonable rate if you give clients the impression that you have a shallow knowledge of several areas, rather than deep knowledge of one area.

In particular, if you are only in your early 20s, then clients are going to wonder just how much time you have had to use these languages outside the classroom. Immersion - and I mean more than a couple of months on a summer course - improves your credibility, and credibility is what makes clients think "Hmm, maybe we'll give this guy a try."

With that in mind, I'd begin thinking about concentrating on one source language. A person who focuses solely on translating Russian to German, every day, is probably going to be more efficient and proficient than somebody devotes a third of their time translating from Russian, a third to translating from Chinese and a third to translating from English. That's not to say that some translators don't make a living from that, but I reckon in many cases it means that they lack traction in one pair and so have been forced to spread themselves over multiple languages.

Financial translation can be lucrative. You will need to be able to prove that you know something about finance, preferably through personal experience. What do you know?

The above is opinion, not fact. We are discussing probabilities, not certainties. There are many routes to success, and a determined individual can shift the balance in their favour. Search the forum for more on specialisation and the utility or otherwise of a master's degree. Suffice it to say that both subjects have been been discussed at great length, and opinions vary. I'm a firm believer in finding areas of specialisation and sticking to them.

Are you wedded to the idea of translation? Why not try getting a job in a big German firm and working for them for ten years. Your language skills would come in useful and Heidelberg's a good uni, right? Come back to translation when you've got some real-world experience under your belt.

Regards,
Dan


Adieu
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Christopher Schröder
Peter Shortall
Michele Fauble
Rachel Waddington
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
 
Adieu
Adieu  Identity Verified
Ukrainian to English
+ ...
Hmmm Mar 28, 2021

Instinctively, I'd say "Study abroad in China - good, German translation degree - horrible"

However, if there is some certification-style qualifications roadblock in your country, then YMMV.


Nikki Scott-Despaigne
 
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 17:14
Member (2007)
English to Portuguese
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@Dennis Mar 28, 2021

Freelancing is hard work and it’s always a struggle to get and keep clients. I started out some 35 years ago and though things were easier by then it took me a whole year. Everyone in this business has bad patches; they happen to the best and most talented of us, for various reasons. Sometimes it’s just because people aren’t spending money, which filters down to you. Sometimes major clients are bought out or go under. I’d say it’s even harder now because of the pandemic. The old laws o... See more
Freelancing is hard work and it’s always a struggle to get and keep clients. I started out some 35 years ago and though things were easier by then it took me a whole year. Everyone in this business has bad patches; they happen to the best and most talented of us, for various reasons. Sometimes it’s just because people aren’t spending money, which filters down to you. Sometimes major clients are bought out or go under. I’d say it’s even harder now because of the pandemic. The old laws of supply and demand are at play here: on one hand, there’s much supply as many unemployed people turned to translation thinking it was an easy way out and, on the other hand, there’s a lot less demand from agencies and direct clients. Occasionally you simply feel like throwing in the towel when you can’t see a way forward, but this often happens just before the dawn. With courage, determination, commitment, organization and a little bit of luck, you can find yourself in the happy situation of having the lifestyle, career and income you dreamed of. Take my advice: network, raise your profile, and keep in touch with job opportunities. As regards your questions:

1. I’m not sure a master’s degree will really improve your career prospects; you don’t need one to be successful in translation. But if you want to better your skills set, it definitely helps.
2. Personally, I translate exclusively into my native language and this is required by many agencies and direct clients.
3. Specializing is important, but you should specialize in something you enjoy and are interested in not because it’s well paid. There's a lot of truth in the saying that you do better at things you enjoy…

Good luck!
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Peter Shortall
Christopher Schröder
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Kay-Viktor Stegemann
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
 
Peter Shortall
Peter Shortall  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Romanian to English
+ ...
Ingredients of long-term success Mar 28, 2021

I agree with Teresa's post. I would just add one extra thought to this point:

Teresa Borges wrote:

3. Specializing is important, but you should specialize in something you enjoy and are interested in not because it’s well paid. There's a lot of truth in the saying that you do better at things you enjoy…


I would advise you to focus on a field you find interesting which is in demand. There's no point offering something the market doesn't want, if you want to make a living from translation. Law, business, finance, medicine, pharmacy, engineering, IT, telecoms, sciences... these are some of the most sought-after fields. The more complex the field and its terminology, the better, because that means that MT is less likely to be used as a means of reducing your income. If you can gain both enjoyment and a decent income from your work, this should set you up nicely for a successful career. It doesn't have to be a binary choice.

When you're starting out, it's natural to assume that languages are all you need to learn in order to become a translator, but in fact, this is only one side of the coin. Two kinds of knowledge are needed: knowledge of your working languages, naturally, but also knowledge of the things that languages are used to talk about. This is the real-world knowledge that Dan mentions. That's what enables you to choose the right words and expressions in a specialised translation. You need to understand in depth what specialists in a field write about, and a master's degree in translation isn't the best way of gaining that knowledge. Working in the field (finance, or whatever it happens to be) is the best way; high-level study of it would be the next best.

[Edited at 2021-03-28 11:40 GMT]


Dan Lucas
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Michele Fauble
Rachel Waddington
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
 
Lingua 5B
Lingua 5B  Identity Verified
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 18:14
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
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Some inputs. Mar 28, 2021

Dennis Zybin wrote:
I thought that Chinese-German should be profitable, because these countries have strong economic ties and few Germans know Chinese and there are not as many Chinese in Germany as in English-speaking countries.


What type of business goes on between Germany and China exclusively, without involvement of international market? If international market is involved, and Germany is one country in the chain, everything will be processed from Chinese to English first and will be in English by the time it reaches Germany.

You didn't mention English to German pair for some reason, that would probably be the best option for you out of all that you listed (when it comes to freelance translation). Perhaps put English to German as your first pair on ProZ and send applications for this pair exclusively for about few weeks, then see if anything changes. Maybe your rate plays a role too as most agencies would prefer a low rate from a beginner (I know it's not fair, as you do seem qualified).

Unfortunately, when it comes to freelance translation, I wouldn't say your degree plays a big role per se, as most clients are interested in experience, regardless of degree. It may be needed if you're helping an agency apply for a tender, but I wouldn't advise this type of projects, as they lack transparency.

Regarding Chinese-German your better odds would be in diplomacy, in house positions, some Chinese companies based in Germany or German companies in China (in house staff translator), interpreting, etc. I agree with Dan, some real-world experience under your belt would be ideal for you to build you both as a professional and as a person. Later on you can come back to freelancing.

*Also: Add some samples to your profile. If you haven't done any work yet, choose some random samples in your preferred target fields, translate them, and ask the source text author for permission to publish them on your profile.



[Edited at 2021-03-28 10:24 GMT]


 
Kuochoe Nikoi-Kotei
Kuochoe Nikoi-Kotei  Identity Verified
Ghana
Local time: 17:14
Japanese to English
Don't do it Mar 28, 2021

Dennis Zybin wrote:
So now, I am thinking about getting a Master’s degree in translation, and I have a few questions:

1. Will a Master’s degree in translation make it possible for me to become a freelance translator, or will it be just as difficult afterwards?

Speaking as someone who has just such a Master's Degree, it helps somewhat, but not enough to justify the cost. If anything, it will make you a little too specialized in translation, making it harder to get into other fields if you change your mind later. If you must get an MA - and I don't see why, TBH - make it something more flexible and future-oriented, so to speak.


Peter Shortall
 
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Nikki Scott-Despaigne  Identity Verified
Local time: 18:14
French to English
General agreement Mar 28, 2021

Dan points out that what is posted here is personal opinion and not fact. That is important to remember. Same caveat for what I am about to write here.

Translating from any of the languages you mention into your native language of German will increase the likelihood of your translation being a quality service people are willing to pay for. By way of an example, in your first sentence in English, you make a very basic mistake: "I have graduated last year..." should read "I graduated
... See more
Dan points out that what is posted here is personal opinion and not fact. That is important to remember. Same caveat for what I am about to write here.

Translating from any of the languages you mention into your native language of German will increase the likelihood of your translation being a quality service people are willing to pay for. By way of an example, in your first sentence in English, you make a very basic mistake: "I have graduated last year..." should read "I graduated last year...". You have a marker of time so you cannot use the present perfect. This type of slip can happen with people who have an excellent level of English. It is the kind of mistake that a native speaker could not make. That is why it is a good idea to stick to translating into your native language. I would exclude translating between two non-native languages

There are rare situations where native speakers are not easily available and where these conventions are not necessarily adhered to. TO the best of my knowledge, the languages you mention are not among those exceptions.

Next, I'd agree with many others that it is tough. We've all been there. Bear in mind that you do not have to go through agencies. Building a portfolio of clients, agencies or direct clients, will take time. If you have specific knowledge or experience in a given field, then focus on those skills to start with. Contact businesses specialising in your area of knowledge and confidence.

Further study may help but there are many types of education and further training that can help along the way. A master's degree in translation would hopefully give you new skills. If you do decide to follow that path, be critical of the content in making your choice. Ask yourself how this will actually make you more interesting to new clients. It should, but will it really?

Translating in fields you know something about is one of the best ways to gain credibility. After all, you will be confident as you know what you are writing about. You can of course gain knowledge in new areas along the way.
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Dan Lucas
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Michele Fauble
 
Baran Keki
Baran Keki  Identity Verified
Türkiye
Local time: 20:14
Member
English to Turkish
Why freelance from the start? Mar 28, 2021

You'll gather from the countless threads on the subject that getting established takes time and, depending on your language pair, it may take months, if not years, before you land a proper job from one of the agencies that you've applied to.
I think, at this point, you need experience and subject matter expertise (as suggested by others), and you wouldn't be able to get those quickly and adequately from freelancing and, in my humble opinion, by pursuing an academic program.
I'd see
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You'll gather from the countless threads on the subject that getting established takes time and, depending on your language pair, it may take months, if not years, before you land a proper job from one of the agencies that you've applied to.
I think, at this point, you need experience and subject matter expertise (as suggested by others), and you wouldn't be able to get those quickly and adequately from freelancing and, in my humble opinion, by pursuing an academic program.
I'd seek an in-house translator position if I were you. By working as an in-house translator (at a translation agency) you would get a steady flow of work on select subject matters, be able to fully master your source languages, learn from your colleagues at work and become a more seasoned and proficient translator in a relatively short amount of time. Perhaps you might not earn as much at first, but the constant on the job experience and learning from your colleagues will pay dividends in the future when you make the switch to freelancing.
I'd also save the money and avoid braving a travel to Asia at a time like this.
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Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 17:14
Member (2007)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
@Dennis Mar 28, 2021

May I suggest that you get in touch with the Delegation of the EU to China? Maybe an internship...

https://eeas.europa.eu/delegations/china/area/contacts_en


Nikki Scott-Despaigne
 
Kay-Viktor Stegemann
Kay-Viktor Stegemann
Germany
Local time: 18:14
English to German
In memoriam
Go for Chinese agencies Mar 28, 2021

Your story sounds as if you only applied to German agencies. This is not a perfect strategy. German agencies will naturally know many German native translators, so that your competition is fierce. It is always a good idea to apply to agencies in the countries of your source language(s).

Chinese agencies might not be as attractive as others in terms of rates, but they are certainly an option for you to get an entry and experience, and being able to communicate in Chinese can be a big
... See more
Your story sounds as if you only applied to German agencies. This is not a perfect strategy. German agencies will naturally know many German native translators, so that your competition is fierce. It is always a good idea to apply to agencies in the countries of your source language(s).

Chinese agencies might not be as attractive as others in terms of rates, but they are certainly an option for you to get an entry and experience, and being able to communicate in Chinese can be a big advantage for you. I work for several Chinese agencies. It seems to me that what Chinese end clients usually do is translate everything into English themselves (which often turns out poorly) and then have the English non-native content translated further into other languages, instead of translating directly from Chinese to the final target language(s). This has many drawbacks. They might not even be interested to change this, but as a speaker of Chinese it would be much easier for you to check the original Chinese source and clarify it with them, even if you only translate English to German in the end. Just an idea. The bottom line is always that you need a competitive advantage, something that only you can do and not every other translator. Such a thing is much more valuable than any degree.
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